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Thread: Mountain Lion eats drives?

  1. #101
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    To unclemac and damien - about boot times on MacPro 5,1.

    To repeat my initial posting under "Sins of Mountain Lion" -
    Three HDs inside (four bootable partitions):

    SSD with Snow Leopard
    SSD with Mountain Lion
    Seagate 1TB SATA with Snow Leopard (back up).

    Total Boot times (up to log in window):
    SSD with Snow Leopard - 30 sec
    SATA with Snow Leopard - 45 sec
    SSD with Mountain Lion - 72 sec
    Duration of the black screen was 15 sec in all cases. Both SSDs the same - from MacGurus.

    Yes unclemac, 15 sec dark screen AFTER I push the power button, BEFORE the chime. Mind you, the monitor is turned on first. And the same for all operating systems, including the Bootcamp Windows7 partition.

    Damien: are you implying the 15 sec dark time is due to a bad RAM stick? (My total of 10GB isn't massive amount). And yes damien, the boot volume in system preferences is ALWAYS specified (unless I accidentally forget). Normally I boot into Snow Leopard. Then I can boot into others using the "Start up Disk"; or after shut down, use option key/power button.

    I see two problems:
    1. The long dark screen time before the chime. Perhaps I should call Apple; they will give me all free advice I need since I have AppleCare. But then again, they are only "geniuses"….
    2. The extra long time for ML vs. SL after the chime. That must be OS dependent, don't you think?

    Perhaps if I eliminate the 15 sec dark period before chime, the boot time for SL will become only 15 sec (like yours). But ML is still a mystery.

    Or I could try to take out the three 2GB sticks Apply supplied me, and leave only the 4GB stick I bought from Macgurus. All four put in correct order - according to ML specifications.
    Should I try that? I would like to get Rick's opinion on this.

    marrand

  2. #102
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    I don't think 15 sec is an unlikely time for a POST with 10 GB of memory. 10 Gb is, in the past, an unbelievable amount of memory. We used to talk about how the long the start up was with 2 gb in a Beige Mac.

    Now it just may be possible that there is some corruption or software issue inside the Mountain Lion install. That happens all too often with complex apple upgrades to operating systems. Over the last few years I have reinstalled an operating system after an OS update no fewer than 3 times because of problems caused by a given update. Most of the time I copy back from my backup and just forego that particular update waiting until the next one comes out.

    Once I get caught up and find a few moments to do some startup testing, I will. I have several new products coming out - Thunderbolt and a entire line of Enterprise class SAS RAID system stuff. Been keeping busy. I look forward to seeing what I can on boot times. We have several MacPros here running ML, I will do a few comparisons.

    Rick
    molṑn labe'
    "I am a mortal enemy to arbitrary government and unlimited power. I am naturally very jealous for the rights and liberties of my country, and the least encroachment of those invaluable privileges is apt to make my blood boil."
--Ben Franklin

  3. #103
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    Rick,
    "…15 sec is an unlikely time for a POST with 10GB".
    Sorry, does that mean 15 sec is what you would expect, or is it too long (and thus unlikely in your opinion)??

    Please note that the new MacPro came with its own Mountain Lion on virgin SATA and it was dead slow from the first press of the power button. Only later it "speeded" up 72 sec. So, it wasn't a matter of upgrade.

    And the key question: is this what happens during the "dark period" - RAM is being tested???? (among other things). Somehow I thought the black period was totally due to video card, and that RAM tests come after the chime.

  4. #104
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    Yeah, before the chime RAM and other components are going through test. And 15 seconds seems like a reasonable amount of time for that with 10 GB of memory.

    Being an original version doesn't preclude it having errors. And the original version has been updated with several incremental updates? those are what usually caused me to reinstall from a backup.

    Rick
    molṑn labe'
    "I am a mortal enemy to arbitrary government and unlimited power. I am naturally very jealous for the rights and liberties of my country, and the least encroachment of those invaluable privileges is apt to make my blood boil."
--Ben Franklin

  5. #105
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    Rick,
    Thanks for the quick reply.
    It seems that we ruled out hardware problems as the cause of the long boot time for ML.

    Now, back to software. Mine came with a given version, and was updated immediatly after first configuring to the current one. I really didn't pay much attention at that time since my SL was working perfectly in the same machine. Only lately I decided that ML is a piece of crap and listed its sins here. Seemingly many macgurus are happy with it. Oh well……..

  6. #106
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    Interesting thread hijack gentlemen. Not minding it one bit.

    Haven't had much time to screw with the drive issue, but haven't seen any progress from others on the front. Very disappointing.

    Apple's problem it seems is the very short update cycle they are now in catering to the iOS/Facebook/Twitter users. Adding features that us old pros don't use, and removing stuff we do. I feared this would happen when Steve left us. Apple is quickly becoming the new Microsoft.

    I have been sitting on the sidelines watching this unfold. It's sad, but not surprising. Thinking about building a hackintosh that I can convert to Windows or Linux if they continue on their current course, and run off the cliff.

    That said I've been running ML on the MBP, and the Mini. It seems to work fine for the most part, but I haven't been doing any serious work with it because I just don't trust it. My streamlined OS9 systems were much more stable, and predictable.

    Still running 10.4.11 on the G4 for serious work. It's rock solid, and does everything I need it to do. No OS/DU bugs that trick me into data loss. I know the hardware will eventually die though.

    Way to go Apple.

  7. #107
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    15 seconds sounds like a long time to me......but nothing handy with more than 8GB at the moment. I know several MBPs with 8-12GB floating around at work, and they probably have 1-3 second delays during POST.

    Never timed em, and perhaps it varies widely by model (memory controllers, firmware differences, etc.). Rick has more experience with decked out towers I am sure.......but I don't remember ever seeing a Mac with more than about 5 seconds in POST.

    Maybe my memory is just off. Perhaps I need to recalibrate my POST.....



    Brane: I feel ya, but change will continue, on all platforms. That's what drives sales and companies. Apple is no different, much as we might want it to be.

    I lament the loss of rack mount, enterprise gear. Love the specs of the new Cube Pro...ah, I mean Mac Pro, and it is an impressive design. But will not be a good server. No more server friendly hardware. No easy swap of power supplies, no PCIe slots......a huge step backwards. Really wanted a convertible tower. A stripped down, optimized version of the previous tower that could easily fit in a rack. Who knows, if the new garbage disposal shape is not a hit, we could see a redesign in a short amount of time.... For the first time in I-don't-know-how-long, I actually kinda hope the Mac Pro is a failure, so we can move on to a more practical and flexible design.

    It ain't just old timers. Apple is full speed ahead on the consumer market, after decades of fighting (perhaps poorly) an losing in enterprise. Ironically, MS is chasing hard in consumer gear. Will Apple or someone else pivot to attack enterprise, as MS seems to be coasting on old tech more than ever? Dunno. Just know the change will not stop.
    "Imagine if every Thursday your shoes exploded if you tied them the usual way. This happens to us all the time with computers, and nobody thinks of complaining." -- Jef Raskin

  8. #108
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    unclemac:

    Even though Rick said 15 sec of black screen (till chime) is ok, I too thought it rather long. So, I removed two original Apple 2GB sticks, leaving original 2 and Macgurus 4 inside (6 GB RAM total).

    Hahaha……the dark period went to 12 sec, and all I saved was 3 sec for all types of booting. A constant saving of 3 sec.
    Then I switched the 2GB stick with another (considering damien's note that one stick maybe bad), and rebooted various ways. No dice. Saving only 3 sec.

    So, back to all sticks and 10 GB. I will wait till Rick gets back to me and then maybe call Apple.

    I plan to tune this machine as well as I can since I am convinced it is the last useful Macintosh Apple will ever offer me.

  9. #109
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    Huh.

    Still seems too long, but I have nothing to test against. May pop by the local Apple reseller and time theirs if I can, to see what a late model MP with around 12GB does.

    My 2009 Xserve with 6GB running 10.7.5 server is probably 1-2 seconds to chime, 45 or so to desktop. Fairly clean system though.

    Like I said, could be "normal" for some models, but I do know late model MBPs with 8GB that don't take more than a 1-2 seconds.
    "Imagine if every Thursday your shoes exploded if you tied them the usual way. This happens to us all the time with computers, and nobody thinks of complaining." -- Jef Raskin

  10. #110
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    My black screen time (from button press to grey screen) is just under 4 seconds. I have 8gb ram in a core i7 mini. OS 10.9 but I don't remember it being any longer under 10.8
    Damien,

  11. #111
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    Damien and unclemac:

    The more I think about it, the more I become convinced that the there is something wrong with my new MacPro to produce these unusually long boot times. Upgrading to Mavericks didn’t help at all.

    At the moment I suspect the video card (but have no evidence or guidance from above). Plan to contact Apple on this tomorrow.
    marrand

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