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Thread: HELP!! please? ATI Rage 128/B&W Yosemite

  1. #1
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    Exclamation HELP!! please? ATI Rage 128/B&W Yosemite

    Please help me!!! Stuck on a late deadline..
    I have a newly acquired B&W G3 (rev.2, firmware updated). I'm having problems getting the video card running properly. I tried to run my old number nine imagine 128 card in it but no go. At any rate, I DO get a display - but the quickdraw performance is ATROCIOUS. I do alot of CAD drawing (quickdraw engine) and the regeneration time is unbelievably slow. So I went to the ATI site, downloaded the latest drivers for the RAGE 128 (this is the bundled version by the way) and when I try to go into the control panel I get the message "cannot find any ATI display product".

    Next - I go into the Apple System Profiler and get the following info abou the card:
    Display Card (DVD)
    Card Type: Display
    Card Name: ATY, Rage 128Y
    Card Model: ATY, Rage 128
    Card ROM#: 113-57407-204
    Card Revison: 0
    194
    Card Vendor ID: 1002
    VRAM size: 16MB

    Judging from the info... it seems the firmware might be buggered - perhaps why I'm having problems?? Cannot seem to find ANY info on firmware updates for this card.

    ANY IDEAS??
    PLEASE help!!

    please e-mail direct if possible: dewdney@comcast.net

    Jonathan

  2. #2
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    Default

    If you are running OS 9, or even 8.5.1+ the drivers are part of OS 9. Just install the system properly. Unless your new/old B&W is defective of course.

    Most people would do a clean install of the OS after initializing the hard drive.

    An ATI Radeon would do better.

    Make sure you have enough quality RAM such as ours - most people go through a lot to learn what to use.

    There is a lot of upgrading possible and available, but when starting off, well, not sure B&W is a good starting point. CPU, RAM, disk drive controller and drives, video card. When done it should do better, but that is over 5 yr old technology.

    There aren't any firmware updates for OEM cards.

    As long as you set your forum preferences, you should receive email updates of replies, no need to take this off line to email discussion. There are dozens of members who have or have used B&W and know them inside and out and can offer advice.

  3. #3
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    Default

    If you decide to replace the card:

    I have the original ATI MAC Radeon PCI card. It was in my B&W G3. This is no "flashed" PC card.

    How about $100.00 + shipping?

    sblasl@cox-internet.com
    Cheers,

  4. #4
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    Before spending money, find out what you have, what works. As for upgraded video, with the new ATI Radeon 9200 (PCI, $120) due soon, either that or pick up one of the older cards when you can.... or move up to an AGP G4 before investing more in B&W...

  5. #5
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    Default hmmm... other advice??

    Thanks for your replies thus far. It just seems so weird to me that this card can be outpaced by my old Number Nine (I-128) by a factor of something like TEN (at least!!) on my old 7500! That thing was INSANELY fast with 200Mb+ photoshop files... this thing has a HELL of a hard time moving around in a 10Mb file at 3:1 magnification!

    SO - is it even POSSIBLE that the card can provide my machine with the basic VIDEO - but WITHOUT quickdraw acceleration?? Conceivable? Can the firmware possibly be damaged?? I was just hoping SOMEONE could give me a quick bit of advice that might make this card viable for me. Judging from the numbers though - none of the other, newer cards really seem that much faster. What the heck!

    At any rate, maybe there's a really good source of info someone can give me on nvidia vs. ATI vs. whatever else products might be out there esp. for photoshop, etc.. I'd love to see some G3 benchmarks!

    I just don't know what to do!

    Thanks again and keep 'em coming if you think you can help me.

    Jonathan

  6. #6
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    Default QUICK question...

    One fast thing... SO - IF I'm buying a NEW card, does using a G3 with OS 9 or 9.1 preclude me from using any of the AGP cards?? I thought I read something on XLR8YOURMAC that said so... any hints?

    Jonathan

  7. #7
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    Jonathan,

    no AGP card will work in a B&W, it has no AGP slot. Talking about PCI slots, is your 128 card in the 66MHz (top) slot?

    biggles.
    "illegitimis non carborundum"

  8. #8
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    Default no it isn't.

    should it be... doesn't that make only a MINOR (at best difference) due to slightly shorter circuit path? Anyway, what the heck. I'll try it now.


    J

  9. #9
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    We're in the dark when we dont' know what you have or have not done, what hardware is installed, quality of RAM, disk drive(s), controllers, PCI cards, cpu.

    If your system folder doesn't have the necessary extensions, yes, it could run like molasses.

    The Radeon 7000 or 7200 tend to run 10% slower in the 33 MHz slot. The three 33 MHz slots share PCI bandwidth. The 66 MHz slot is by itself. Do you really think distance is what makes it faster? No, that it is on its own bridge.

    A clean OS, with no extra extensions, matters. And a proper disk drive. Along with 125 MHz SDRAM. G4/500 or better. ATA/133 controller. 120GB drive with 8MB cache. A copy of Disk Warrior 2.11, but not Noton.

    Clear nvram and pram with Open Firmware.
    start up with command option O F and entering:

    reset-nvram
    set-defaults
    reset-all

    I'd say your system and software aren't properly installed, and that the disk drive needs to be initialized. (Think I said that before).
    Last edited by TZ; 06-22-2004 at 05:14 AM.

  10. #10
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    Default Okay - now you can all HATE me...

    Alright - guess what?? (and yes, I feel stupid - and YES, I will flog/humiliate myself on the behalf of anyone that cared enough to think about this or respond....)

    So I thought I'd check which slot the card was sitting in - and then saw, and REMEMBERED - that my Applevision 1710AV monitor cable did NOT mate at all with the ATI card - and in fact the monitor is plugged into my Number Nine card (imagine 128) - so then it dawned on me - that this early misapprehension caused me NOT ever to load the NN drivers (since I wasn't using the card, right??) - so I've loaded them now and the thing BLAZES!! Even better than before on my 7500

    IF ONLY I COULD GET A COPY OF MACBENCH SOMEWHERE TO BENCHMARK IT!!! I suspect this card MAY be faster than the ATI, at least for 2D operations (I need HUGE numbers of polygons/lines per sec - 3D is NOT that important, or AS important).

    Anyway, thanks all - I really appreciate the responses - and I did learn a thing or 2 about newer video cards - I especially appreciate the LAST response, with the NVRAM trick - I thought that was only settable by CUDA switch or whatever it's called (I'm all old school and out of it)!

    Thanks again,
    Jonathan

  11. #11
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    Jonathan,
    I have not been in on this thread but I will say that we always appreciate someone reporting back after success. Too often Members don't report back and we wonder what happened? Did we turn them off or what?

    We all have made such mistakes, even when we think we KNOW that we have setup something corrrectly, only to find later that we have done a DUH! Never hurts here to admit a mistake.

    Send me an email. I think I can help you out with something else. I have my hands full until early afternoon on the left coast but I will respond. k

  12. #12
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    Number Nine card (imagine 128)
    Just have to ask, as I don't think I've read/heard of this card.

  13. #13
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  14. #14
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    Default Kaye!!

    Hey, I tried to e-mail you (at your request) but it looks like your prefs are blocking you receiving anything. You should see MY e-mail at the start of the thread (unless removed). let me know...

    J

  15. #15
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    Found your email address at the beginning of the thread. Sorry about the blocking. I have an industrial strength spam and virus filter on a server about 1500 miles away from me. I don't know why it blocked you but it traps about 5000 emails a week. Before I got it, I was getting between 300 to 400 a day. Now it would be 700+ a day when in fact about a dozen real emails do come thru. I have it filtering two accounts.

    Will email you. k

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