Results 1 to 16 of 16

Thread: Mac dinosaur wants to enter new century. Help!

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    11

    Default

    Here's what I'm running now (please keep laughter to a dull roar): Power Mac 8500/132 with Sonnett G3 233MHz processor upgrade card, ATI 32MB video, System 8.5, Sony 21" monitor, HP LaserJet 4MP printer from 1993, cable modem. I work as a professional freelance designer with this setup. Everything works fine (except maybe streaming video and DHCP handling) but I'm starting to run into clients' Illustrator 9 &10 files (I have ver. 8). I also have PhotoShop 5, Office 98, Quark 4.1. I've been reluctant to upgrade the system software or apps to something short of System X native because I keep thinking I'll soon have new hardware and System X. Now I think maybe the time to take the plunge but, you guessed it, what about Quark? (WARNING: knowledge gap approaching!) Do any of the FW800 Macs boot into Sys 9? I don't want to spend the money for the earlier Dual 1.25GHz model which I understand does boot Sys 9. Will a FW800 Mac run Quark in Classic out of the box? What is the difference between Classic and Sys 9? Does Classic need System 9 to work? Is Sys 9 included with Jaguar? I use Quark every day and God knows when that will be System X native. Also, if I don't do that much PhotoShop can I get away with the 1GHz 800FW with 768 MB ram or does Jaguar REQUIRE dual processors to work properly? Thanks for reading my long cry for help. Cheers.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Grangeville, ID USA
    Posts
    9,124

    Default

    Hi,

    ?Welcome to the forums. (that always sounds like we have lions for you to play tag with in front of a lot of people)

    ?Apple is currently making models that will boot OS9. You'll need to have a fire extinguisher handy though, to put out the flames when your hair is on FIRE. Switching from a 233 8500 to a 1 gig tower is gonna light you up. Apple OS9 Systems

    ?Too bad you can't wait for Quark. I thought they'd already set a date of something. All the rest are REALLY good on OSX. Make sure you plan lots of RAM. G4s LOVE ram. OSX LOVES RAM!

    ?I am running Jag on my Quicksilver 867, It snorts and does a reasonably fair imitation of a fast computer. But the new Duals just plain leave that in the dust. You do not NEED a dual unless you just need a dual cause they're fast. Some of us have problems with not havin the fastest around. Emotional that is.

    ?Well, good luck, whatever you decide.

    Rick

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Mobius Strip
    Posts
    13,045

    Default

    You could just add a G4/700 ($299) and upgrade disk drives (which you can use in any new system later), and probably add some memory if you don't have 1GB already ($108/512MB).

    That will let you run OS X and get through this year and look at what Apple has in the fall or next January (meaning a year from now by the time they ship and have a rev 2 model).

    Sonnet's installer works very well. And you'll find the G4/700 to plow through what you do now. Apple Store Specials has a dual 1.25GHz for ~$2100 I think currently if that is more to your liking.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    11

    Default

    Thanks for the responses so far. Can anyone address my questions about System 9, the Classic environment, and Quark in the second half of my original post? Cheers.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Mobius Strip
    Posts
    13,045

    Default

    MacFixit and MacIntouch have had inklings but I can't even venture at Quark + Classic. I do know that there were reports from users of quite a bit of real trouble leading users to abandon using Classic environment in favor of true OS 9 system. That has changed I think, check Quark support site for updates. Some people though are fed up and switching to Adobe rather than wait, but Quark may be getting the message.

    the fact that Norton is crappy iwth OS X, that Disk Warrior hasn't been released, tends to suggest it isn't as easy as Apple led developers to believe.

    Quark 6 Special Report is probably the best bet.

    A www.macfixitforums.com thread suggests that 10.2.4 and an update from Quark for 4.1.1 now provide better support in Classic. * URL didn't work but a quick search of their forum should "quark" and "switch"

    You can't boot FW800 Macs into OS 9. That's a given. Can Quark be updated running Classic? or install? I think that's the hardest part right now.

    PS has its own way of using (or not, as the case may be) as much memory as possible, but most users tend to feel that a whopping 1GB RAM is a good start. Dual is better, too. Fewer delays and much more responsive; but, for general use, my B&W G4/500 768MB is fine. If it was me, I'd fork over the extra $$$ ($500-700) and go for the dual. Otherwise, if you want to wait, a G4/700-800 gives you a small boost over what you have now for the interim while IBM 970's and Quark work things out.

    OS X does tend to encourage doing more things and leaving apps open, rather than one app running well at the expense of doing other things.

    [This message has been edited by Gregory (edited 02 March 2003).]

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    arlington,vermont
    Posts
    826

    Default

    Yes out of the box Quark 4.1.1 will install into classic and you should not run into many problems. I have quark 4 and quark 5 installed on several computers at work runnning 10.2.3. We have the occasional scren draw problems, but nothing more major than that. You will need to upgrade Illustrator, because it will not run well (if at all in slassic), but it sounds like that is the plan for you anyway. There isa special running today at smalldogs that is pretty nice. powermac, plus 17" lcd, plus office X for 2300 bucks. And yes the 1gig single will be just fine, considering that the majority of PS users in the business are running alot less than that.

    [This message has been edited by tm311 (edited 02 March 2003).]

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    NW Montana
    Posts
    8,197

    Default

    Let me really goof you up.

    When running OS X 10.1.x to Jag 10.2.x you do not need system 9. **If running all OS X applications**

    "Classic" means you boot the computer into an X version and then open a OS 9 file/app and your running "Classic" at that time - you can work with your OS 9 files fine edit/save etc. This means you should/need a partition for OS 9. Or 3 partitions 1. OS X, 2. Data/storage, 3. OS 9 -- This discussion really varies on your needs and such.

    Most people keep OS 9 and OS X on 2 partitions or drives even. I only boot into OS 9 to play "Unreal Tournament" so I have one small OS 9 partition and a large X partition. I also have a second drive with both systems on it.

    I am running the QS 733, OS 10.2.4, 896MB RAM, GeForce2 MX 32MB. Really runs nice. But my "Unreal Tournament - OS 9" plays and looks like crap in "classic" kicks butt in OS 9.2.2

    Randy

    [This message has been edited by rwm2 (edited 02 March 2003).]

    [This message has been edited by rwm2 (edited 02 March 2003).]

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    11

    Default

    Continued thanks to all who have taken the time to help me. The picture is becoming clearer. However, I am still a little fuzzy about a couple of simple things. If i get a new FW800 desktop will the loaded System 10.2.x include a functioning Classic environment? In other words is some kind of Sys 9 included? Or am I expected to already have a version of Sys 9 that I load so Classic can access it? That would be a problem because I never have had Sys 9, only 8.5 and I don't know how I would get Sys 9 NOW. Cheers.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    NW Montana
    Posts
    8,197

    Default

    If you buy new - most likely you'll get OS 10.1.x installed on it and the install CD. BUT you will also get a OS 9.2.2 install CD too.

    Randy

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Mobius Strip
    Posts
    13,045

    Default

    I was under the impression that 9.2.2. is only in a restore image, not on a CD (and someone said it came as DVD now). You can extract and restore, or backup the system and then partition your drive. But yes, there is a Classic environment.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    on the landline, Mr. Smith
    Posts
    7,787

    Default

    Can't speak to each model, but the most recent mac we purchased at work was a new 17" imac; it did come with all software on a DVD, and 9.2.2. Have not had time to play with the DVD yet to see if you can install a bootable version of 9 ( but I would expect not).

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    NW Montana
    Posts
    8,197

    Default

    Hummmmmmmmmm Back to eBay? I bought an OS 9.0 install CD and the updater to 9.1 for 20 bucks over a year ago.

    Randy

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Brooklyn, NY, 11226
    Posts
    97

    Default

    My 2c: Quark as a company is kind of like the U.S. as a country - they dominate their world, and are rather arrogant about the whole thing.

    Every Quark owner/user I know has had a bad experience with the company if they needed to contact them for help - and you can see how they are treating the market as a whole with their 'in our own sweet time' attitude towards providing timely and compatible software.

    Based on principle alone I switched to InDesign over a year ago and have been pretty happy. If your printer doesn't take an InDesign file they'll take a .pdf file -- just be careful with the transparencies - it's easy to get carried away.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    11

    Default

    Thanks to all who responded. The info has been a big help.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    maryland
    Posts
    564

    Default

    rkenney:
    There is classic 9 and there is bootable OS9. Classic 9 runs only after booting in to OSX. Before buying my MDD (dec. 2002 vintage) I feasted on macgurus' wisdom, and learned that, as rwm2 points out in this thread, that classic is crap and OS9.2.2 kicks ass. So, I suggest you reconsider -- perhaps 1.25dual which boots into both is best even if you don't plan to use both immediately. Personally, I felt shafted when Apple proceeded with benign neglect of OS9 before they ironed out all kinks from OSX.
    My own setup is similar to what rwm2 described: two drives, three partitions each, lavish amount of RAM and disk space. This way I cover all bets; companies like Quark and Apple no longer leave me in the cold.
    PS: I learned something interesting from you -- a professional freelance designer making his business go on an 7 year old Mac, 10 year old printer, photoshop 5 and 233MHz??? That's a great testimonial to how good Apple computers were (are?).
    marrand

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    Westerly, RI, USA
    Posts
    132

    Default

    Hey rkenney12,

    Looks like most of the questions have been answered here. Let me just say this: Drop Quark. Adobe has done a great job with InDesign. I use InDesign on everything now and i have found that many printers will take the ID files without a problem. Quark just is not a good enough product to hold you back from anything. Plus the integration with the other Adobe apps is tops. Just be aware that the system requirements for ID are pretty serious. For example, I wouldn't even try it on your current setup.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •