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Thread: great web browser

  1. #1
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    I'm not trying to tell anyone else what to do and I'm not sure this is the best
    Forum for this post but I wanted to share something I just recently discovered.
    I have been using Chimera for the past week and am as pleased as I've ever been with a browser. I've hated ie for all the crashes and omni web has let me down becasue it won't interface with some secure sites I need to access but so far, knock on wood, Chimera has not crashed and it logs in to all the sites I've visited with no problems. I haven't yet taken advantage of all features but the tabs are great! And this is really fast, much more so than any other I've tried thus far. BTW, I'm talking OSX only. Give it a try I think you'll be happy.

    ----------------------------------------
    Edit: Has Safari won out the hearts and minds of most OS X users yet?

    And, can this thread be reactivated???

    [This message was edited by TZ on Thu September 25, 2003 PT at 12:21.]

  2. #2
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    b,

    ?And what do you REALLY think? (jus kiddin)

    ?Thanks for the tip. Personally I very much appreciate it when forum members pass on their likes and dislikes.

    Rick

  3. #3
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    Phoenix - new, future branch of Mozilla project. Lots of nice features, like pop-up blocking, etc.

    Safari from Apple. b67 is so much better you'd think Apple would kindly post it - public beta of OS X was snapped up beyond expectations and users are use to OmniWeb, Mozilla, Camino nightly builds. (You DO need broadband though to play this game.)

    Camino

    But sometimes, a page won't print right in any of these, so I stilll need to keep MSIE on hand. Or a site that really does require MSIE - I dislike it when a site says works best in Internet Explorer - Netscape 1.1PR? Mozaic? they gave me a glimpse into a graphics style web back in '93 and we'd peer over someone's shoulder and be amazed to see stuff online from around the world - artwork, museums coming online, that kind of thing.


    [This message has been edited by Gregory (edited 07 April 2003).]

  4. #4
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    I just tried Camino yesterday. I thought it was a upgrade to Chimera and did not keep using it.

    I like Chimera. I have found a site or two that IE works better. Usually java windows.

    Randy

  5. #5
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    I just downloaded and am trying Safari. I like it BUT why does most the small text seem fuzzy? Like the forum posts?

    Randy

  6. #6
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    Just to be clear, for those any have not tried them yet, Camino is the latest and greatest of what was Chimera, correct? So maybe we should also document that Mozilla, Chimera, Camino, the latest Netscape, and Phoenix (Thanks, G - I was not aware of this one) are all close cousins....built on the same foundation.

    For those who have not used any of these, it kinda sounds like they are totally different animals....

  7. #7
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    Can you import Chimera's or IE's bookmarks into Safari? I can't seem to find a way. - Randy

  8. #8
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    Very ease to import bookmarks. There are scripts and such, but for Camino (don't recall Chimera), you export bookmarks and that will import.

    There are programs "Safari Enhancer" that enable importing. Safari is weird. It only auto imports once - from IE of all things. Come on people! stop this monopoly of IE's! The later builds of Safari are much better, too. But no longer easy to find.

    I like to use IE to import, sort, arrange, then export. And every web browser supports IE's Favorites.

  9. #9
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    OmniWeb 4.2 is here. And, if you have a license, you should get informed that they have started a Sneakypeek 4.5sp1 that is based on some of the same WebCore engine as Safari.

    - G.

    [This message has been edited by Gregory (edited 09 April 2003).]

  10. #10
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    Safari v71 (public beta 2) is out... but it isn't "public" and I wish that Apple would put another one up to improve on that March 12th build that, while nice, suffers in comparison!

  11. #11
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    The official Safari Beta 2 is finally available via SU or for download from Apple. Text is sharp, fast, good support for popups, cookies, forms, even username gets filled in. But it seems buggier than v.67 was. You can't highlight and select text, you have to double and triple-click text to select.

    I have my doubts about 10.2.x and how much testing or what the interaction with 10.2.5 is.

    [This message has been edited by Gregory (edited 14 April 2003).]

  12. #12
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    When I enter GURU's and then return to GURU's site in "Safari" the STARS showing the new post NEVER changes and is mostly all stars. Things work great in Camino, Exploder, some others once. Others have this problem or have an idea to fix it? I have been living with it but why... Cookies are set on "Only sites I navigate to..."

    The "About Safari" says 1.0 Beta 2 v(73) --- Randy

  13. #13
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    Well, Mozilla flies and works well, even a good replacement for MSIE. Apple was quick to update Safari to address SSL concerns. OmniWeb 4.2.1 was posted this week, and they have the 4.5 "SP" up to 26 (sneaky peek previews for licensed users). The latest builds of Camino/Chimera crash and hasn't been fixed yet.

    And they all handle things differently, how this web site looks and behaves!

    - G.

  14. #14
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    Firebird is an off-shoot of Mozilla. Has some speed and promise, very clean, feels quick, and works well so far. I assume this was Phoenix trunk line (renamed) but not sure.

    - G.

  15. #15
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    Microsoft Internet Explorer downloads page for OS X 5.2.3. In another month they should have 5.1.7 for OS 9.

    I don't recommend IE, the fonts are too small on most sites, but it does sort bookmarks, every browser will import IE Favorites (by default sometimes too), so it is handy to have around.

    At one time, there were operations it was needed for. Now, Mozilla, Camino and even OmniWeb will, and Safari will only get better. If you use OS 8.6/9.x then you might be forced to use MSIE, there aren't as many choices or options (Mozilla stopped development and now focuses only on the OS X version, MACH-O).
    --------------
    Update: it is faster. It still got 'stalled' and you MUST run Repair Permissions afterwards.

    [This message was edited by Gregory on Mon June 16, 2003 PT at 14:22.]

  16. #16
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    Last I heard there was to be no further development for Internet Explorer for Macintosh.
    Ok I get it ...no more development for OS 9.
    Should have known...

    dave

  17. #17
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    Security and bug fix, just now new IE 6 or anything for either OS 9 or Jaguar/Panther. Meaning that if Panther breaks IE 5.2.3, that may or may not be updated and fixed (IE 5.3?)

  18. #18
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    I've been using Mozilla 1.4 and love it. Advanced bookmark support really works well (able to sort and rearrange from main window sidebar).

    http://www.mozilla.org/releases/

    Mac OS X version

    Netscape 7.1 Quite good. Full-featured, fast.



    Also, something to keep in mind:
    quote:
    Web developers smarten up with Safari support: sites listed as incompatible sometimes actually are

    As we've covered in the past, many Web sites unnecessarily block out Safari users, refusing to function for any browser other than Internet Explorer even though Safari has all of the required capability.

    One prime example is PlaceWare's Live Meeting - an entity now owned by Microsoft.

    MacFixIt reader McKnight reports that when attempting to use the Web software with Safari, the following error message is delivered:

    "There are one or more problems preventing you from entering the meeting. ??Please correct the problem(s) below, then click here to try again. There are connection problems preventing you from using PlaceWare. Your browser is Java-enabled, but something else between you and the PlaceWare server, probably a proxy or firewall, is preventing you from fetching Java applications on the web. (It may be preventing you from fetching "jar" files.) If you have an alternate way to connect to the Internet, you should try it.

    "To take advantage of the full functionality of your meeting, you may want to address the following issue(s): You can run PlaceWare on your Platform, but some configuration changes could improve your experience. PlaceWare requires Mac OS-X or later. You are using Netscape Communicator 5 . If you encounter any problems using this browser with PlaceWare, please try using Internet Explorer 5.1 or later.

    McKnight later found that he could access all of the Live Meeting functionality by switching the user agent (accessible through the Safari debug menu) to Internet Explorer, proving that while Safari is fully capable of working with Live Meeting, the browser is needlessly blocked from access.

    As has been the case with other such flaws, McKnight followed up with the company's support department and got something done. The PlaceWare team sent him this reply:

    "We contacted our engineering department and it appears that in the future they will be adding Safari as a certified browser for using on a Mac. At the moment some of the error reporting is inaccurate and will stay that way since we have recently come out with a new version of PlaceWare??s software called Live Meeting 5.0. This version being out our engineering department is no longer updating the version you were testing on (4.3) and that version will be phased out as of the beginning of the year. I hope this helps. At the moment the stated versions of Netscape that were stated earlier are the best to use on a Mac running OS 8 or 9 and IE 5.x is the best for Mac OS X."

    As McKnight points out, the distinction between Internet Explorer and Safari when it comes to pure Java applications is ridiculous: "Internet Explorer uses the JVM (java virtual machine) that comes with the Mac rather than one built into the browser. If that is the only requirement, then blocking the Safari user agent makes even less sense. Since in IE there is no availability of Active-X controls or anything else found on the PC side of the equation, I can think of no other reason why a natively compatible Java used in any OS X browser would not function properly. That being the case, it should take all of about five minutes to certify browsers that use the OS X JVM."

    The moral of the story is that concerned Mac users should follow up with Web developers when presented with a "Internet Explorer-only" or "Safari not compatible" message. In many cases it is ignorance, rather than real lack of functionality from Safari that causes these problems.


    So PLEASE don't spoof web sites into thinking that they are talking to some other browser or platform. Macs use to predominate the online BBSs like CompuServe and others because of the ease of use of the Mac, in higher percentage than the 'mere' marketshare would dictate. Recent statistics show only 2% of online computers appear to be Mac browsers. Of course it could be just from statistical sampling error, maybe they don't check sites that Macs use and frequent and the sites in the survey were more likely to be used and accessed by Windows.

    What I do know is that there is too much FUD, and too little adherence to standards, rather, dishing up web sites by and for Windows software and misunderstanding as in the one example above so well illustrates.

    Added 9-25-03, but the thread is "closed" due to being "inactive" for 60 days, a rule that I would love to see removed.



    PS: Safari's "accept cookies from originating site" is misleading. Any cookies can be added, from any domain, not just the domain of the web site you went to (Doubleclick and lots of others).

    Want good cookie management and to be asked and informed? Look to the latest Mozilla 1.5+.

    [This message was edited by TZ on Mon October 20, 2003 PT at 9:27.]

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