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hapycampr2002
08-29-2008, 08:38 AM
I had a G4 that crashed. Took it in for repair to discover that it needs a new logic board. I have decided to trash it and use the other G4 I have. G4#1, the dead one, had two added HD's in it. When I got the G4#1 back from repair I took the HD's out of #1 and installed them in G4#2, duplicating exactly how they were installed in #1 (I didn't install them initially. I am a neophyte at all of this.) But they don't show up in G4#2. What could be the cause of that?
Thank you for your help.

unclemac
08-29-2008, 10:05 AM
Give us some details about the model G4s........it can matter how the drives are configured, and what the limitations to how drives are set up on the older G4s.

hapycampr2002
08-29-2008, 01:04 PM
Right. The 2 HD's were set up in G4#1 as a RAID. G4#2 is a Dual 800 MHz Power PC G4 with 1GB SDRAM.

ricks
08-29-2008, 01:54 PM
What kind of RAID? What kind of drives? What bus(es) are the drives on? What order do you have them installed in the G4? If they are ATA drives, are they set as Cable Select, Master and Slave? Which G4 model do you have?

Also should ask, why RAID? If the two drives are ATA drives, and you have them both on the same ATA cable, then RAID is really not a good idea. RAID is based on simultaneous access of more than one drive. The problem with having 2 RAID drives on a single ATA channel is that access is limited to one drive at a time. Instead of simultaneous access you get alternating access, which is both slow and risky.

You'll get this figured out. If the data is intact then the drives RAID status won't stop you from getting them mounted. One way or another, at least you should be able to get the data off them and into a single drive.

Rick

Damien
08-29-2008, 07:08 PM
Also unless it has changed recently if you used Softraid then you must install the softraid drivers in the #2G4 before the raid will show

Nicolas
08-31-2008, 01:37 AM
The drive MUST be installed in the same way wich means on the SAME IDE port and on the SAME connector.

If those drive are from an MDD (the MDD has 3 independent IDE controllers) and you installed them ina, let's say a G4 QS or DA (which has 2 IDE controllers) the HD's device ID is getting changed...
E.G. The AppleRAID driver is looking for the RAID at Port3 ID0 and ID1
but now the disks are on Port2 ID0 and ID1, so the RAID driver does not see any RAID member anymore and refuses to work.

This can be changed on another Mac but this information is deep down in the system and not feasible for someone with common OSX knowledge and the worst part you do need access to the RAID to change it. So at least here you're stumped :(

Regards

Nicolas

hapycampr2002
08-31-2008, 08:15 AM
The G4#2 model I have is:
Machine Name: Power Mac G4
Machine Model: PowerMac3,5
CPU Type: PowerPC G4 (2.1)
Number Of CPUs: 2
CPU Speed: 800 MHz
L2 Cache (per CPU): 256 KB
Memory: 1 GB
Bus Speed: 133 MHz
Boot ROM Version: 4.2.4f1
Serial Number: XB132090KSJ
Sales Order Number: M8361LL/A
Being a photographer, and an "artist" at that, I am thinking in more visual terms :) So I though I would attach a picture of how the hardware is set up in the G4#2. I tried to mimic the set up from the G4#1. I hope it helps.
I've done a little bit of reading (I didn't even know what MDD meant until now, but I am learning!!), and it looks like my G4 is the older, non-MDD type. The two HD's are Seagate Barracuda 250 GB connected via two cables and not one.
The RAID was setup using Disk Utility, not using Softraid.
The Disk Utility doesn't even recognize the drives when they are connected.
I noticed that the cable seems a little kinked in places. Could that be the potential problem?

ricks
08-31-2008, 11:01 AM
From the picture it looks like the drives are attached to a PCI card. Start from the beginning, work up.

The drives, if on a card, must both be jumpered to Master.
The drives must have power


They also should be on the same port on the card as they were on the last setup.

Check in System Profiler:
1) is the card showing up properly under PCI Cards?
2) are there any newer drivers for the card?
3) do the drives themselves show up under ATA? One or both drives?

Check in Disk Utility:
1) Do the drives show up there, even though unmounted?
2) try one drive at a time checking in Disk Utility. Should show up in Disk Utility even if the RAID does not.


R

Nicolas
09-01-2008, 04:54 AM
Hello,

and which model is #1?

Regards

Nicolas

hapycampr2002
09-02-2008, 05:26 PM
Hi Nicolas,
See the first post in the thread.
Thx

eric
09-03-2008, 06:26 AM
hapycampr,

There are many models of G4s, which can help us determine more specifics.

See:
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=58418
http://www.everymac.com/systems/by_capability/macs-by-machine-model-machine-id.html

From what you posted about G4#2, it's a Quicksilver. (PowerMac3,5)

So what's G4#1? Is it also a Quicksilver? I can see a QS in the background of the photo you posted below.

Questions:
1. What OS are you using? OS 9 or OS 10?

2. Are the HDs attached to a PCI card? From the photo that's what it looks like.

3. In G4#1, were the HDs always attached to a PCI card or were they attached the motherboard?

The last questions may hold the answers to why they're not mounting on the new G4.

-----------
I'm pretty busy now, and I'm away this weekend. So I may not be able to follow through on this. But I leave the following comments for the other moderators (and others) who will know where I'm going. (Hapycampr don't worry if you don't understand them, the moderators and others will help you through them depending on your answers to my questions. In case you get the itch, do NOT under any circumstances reformat without a backup of those HDs which for the moment aren't mounting.):

Mods,
Remember if he's (or she's) using OS 9, then there's OS 9 driver problems when switching HDs between mb and PCI cards. OS 9 treats HDs on cards as SCSI and so HDs need the SCSI drivers; if they're on the motherboard, then they're treated as ATA and need the ATA drivers. If the HDs were formatted in OS 9, then the HDs will have only one or the other (not both) depending on where they were formatted with Drive Setup; so the HDs are not "switchable" from mb to card without a reformat. If they were originally on the mb, then he may need to stick them back on the mb, to get them to mount. I would then transfer to data to one or the other HDs, or backup them up to an external. If he only has OS 9, then a reformat after the backup will be needed after it's back on the card.
If he has OS X around, then after the backup, I'd reformat with Disk Utility with the option to install OS 9 drivers. Disk Utility in OS X with that option will install both the ATA and SCSI drivers. This will make the HDs easily switchable because OS 9 will always find the right drivers.

unclemac
09-03-2008, 08:42 AM
Nice work eric.

There's so much to forget.....:rolleyes:

Nicolas
09-04-2008, 10:46 PM
Hi Nicolas,
See the first post in the thread.
Thx

Hello,

as Eric sez there is nothing mentioned about G4#1, no model, non which addons in use etc.

Without that info we can not help. :(

Regards

Nicolas

hapycampr2002
09-05-2008, 12:10 PM
You guys are fantastic!! Your help is soooo very appreciated.
Because of another problem I have been having with my G4 (some apps no longer work after I performed a "routine" update) I have decided to buy a used G5 and install the HD's into that machine. That means this thread is about to take a different direction - how do I switch the HD's to the G5? Should I start a new thread with that question?

But here are answers to a few of eric's questions:
Both G4's were running OS 10
Both G4's are "Digital Audio"
HD's were attached to PCI card, which I switched from #1 to #2. I was careful to put the PCI card in the same slot in case that mattered.

Best