View Full Version : Other Operating Systems on MacIntel

01-13-2006, 09:08 AM
I know some have expressed interest, and there is no MacIntel forum (yet). There have been questions about if/when or how to dual-boot and install Windows on Mactel as well as installing OS X on an Intel system. Or running both, side by side.

The prevailing wisdom seems to be that only Windows for Itanium can boot with EFI natively...

Intel Macs May Boot Windows XP After All?
Linked by Eugenia Loli-Queru on 2006-01-13 04:28:14 UTC, submitted by Dan Warne

Reports spreading across the web that Intel Macs can‰t boot Windows XP might be inaccurate. Intel Australia, while being careful not to comment on Apple‰s hardware specifically, says motherboards based on the Intel 945 chipset already support EFI and can boot Windows with no problems. The key appears to be whether Apple has included a "compatibility support module". Explored in more depth in this article at APC Magazine. (http://www.apcmag.com/apc/v3.nsf/0/64E7EA353646669ECA2570F50012430B)

Officially, Microsoft says it will support EFI natively with Windows Vista, so it‰s almost certain that Intel-based MacBook Pros and iMacs will be able to boot Vista when it is released later this year.
This is the critical part:

From page four.

‹For IA 32 systems, the Framework loads itself above the 1MB real-mode memory boundary to accommodate an optional Compatibility Support Module (CSM). CSM implementations can be tailored to platform requirements. A typical CSM is approximately 60KB (~38KB compressed) of firmware that is specific to each Participating Vendor and is based on that Vendor‰s latest BIOS code base. A contemporary implementation of the Framework on a PC includes a CSM for supplying services to operating systems that do not boot using EFI and for supporting legacy option ROMs on add-in cards. For legacy boot the Framework initialises the platform‰s silicon and executes EFI drivers. Then control is transferred to the CSM, which supports the legacy OS boot.Š

So, as long as Apple has included a Compatibility Support Module, Intel-based Macs should be able to boot XP.

It seems unlikely that Apple would have left this out. It has already said it isn‰t doing anything to prevent Windows from booting on a Mac.

There has been some good discussion on Slashdot, Ars, etc. on the subject as well.

Intel provides software to Apple developers

A port of its existing, well-received, and respected math libraries and compilers will bring new performance to Mactel-based applications

Intel's compilers are renowned in the PC world, and consistently generate the best code for not only Intel-based products, but also competing x86-based products. Intel's VTune utility can take application binaries (programs), point out where inefficiencies exist, and even correct many of them during the analysis.

Intel provides development tools to Apple developers (http://www.geek.com/news/geeknews/2006Jan/bch20060113034233.htm) How different are Intel-Macs from Intel PCs? (http://www.tgdaily.com/2006/01/12/how_different_are_the_new_intel-based_macs/)

01-13-2006, 05:11 PM
Apple's Hidden Message to Hackers: "Dont Steal Mac OS X" (http://www.osx86project.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=89&Itemid=2)

<string>Dont Steal Mac OS X</string>
<string>Copyright (c) 2006 Apple Computer, Inc. ćAll rights reserved.

<string>The purpose of this Apple software is to protect Apple copyrighted
materials from unauthorized copying and use. You may not copy, modify,
reverse engineer, publicly display, publicly perform, sublicense,
transfer or redistribute this file, in whole or in part.

If you have obtained a copy of this Apple software and do not have a valid license from Apple Computer to use it, please immediately destroy or delete it from your computer.</string>

The most interesting part of this message? It's placement, found in /System/Library/Extensions/Dont Steal Mac OS X.kext

Despite being a lighthearted jab at hackers, it seems that Apple is taking the pirating of the new OSx86 seriously, since the same kext is not found in the PPC version of 10.4.4.

01-18-2006, 09:38 AM
Our WinTel product built for the new Intel based Macs runs Windows(R) within Mac OS X offering performance we have always dreamed of: nearly native.

Experience full-compatibility with x86/Pentium(R) processors, disk images, CD-ROM support and much more on your Mac.

WinTel is our popular Cocoa graphical user interface used to control the included powerful underlying open-source "Bochs" x86 emulation software (Bochs is pronounced as Box). We now include both PowerPC and Intel optimized binaries.


Will be interesting to see how this performs, and what limitations it has.

01-18-2006, 03:36 PM
OpenOSX - the Fink connection:

01-18-2006, 03:37 PM
Some more information on EFI menu:
Entering the EFI menu on Intel based iMacs (http://nak.journalspace.com/?cmd=displaycomments&dcid=407&entryid=407)
EFI How To Guide (ftp://download.intel.com/technology/efi/docs/txt/EfiHowTo.txt)

01-19-2006, 02:50 PM
Actually, the biggest barrier to booting Windows on an Intel Mac is, as I've been reading on InsideMacGames.com, the fact that Mac video cards are still going to be using specialized Mac ROMS. Therefore, Windows won't be able to recognize them. Why this was done I cannot fathom. Just another reason for Mac users to have to pay more for the exact same hardware. Nevermind the fact the the Radeon 9800 in my Mac was a PC card first.

02-01-2006, 02:12 PM
It appears that EFI may be a BIG plus to hardware developers. SATA, SCSI, Video cards, perhaps RAID controllers, etc., although we won't know until products start to appear (...or not) over the next year or more. Did a little digging and found this info from an Intel .pdf of a a presentation about EFI back in 2003:

What’s Wrong with Traditional BIOS?
• Traditional BIOS technology results in slower ramp to introduce new platform features and initiatives
• Platform compatibility & interoperability affected by OptionROM issues
• Primitive platform manufacturing and testing environment
• Resource pool of assembly programmers is very low
• Cost to maintain & deploy BIOS solutions in the platform is increasing
• 16-bit real mode BIOS is impractical for Itanium® architecture-based platforms

EFI Sets the Stage
• BIOS can be changed without impacting OS
• EFI extensibility makes it easy to add platform capabilities
• EFI delivers a driver model for firmware

– Multi-party code, binary interoperability
• EFI interfaces are CPU architecture neutral
• This project investigates how much can be done given EFI

– A serious technical undertaking
– Not a product announcement
• EFI remains an interface spec for the industry

– Not bound to any particular implementation (including this one)

Technical goals:
• Architectural design to last a second 20 years
• Intel® Itanium® processor family, IA-32, Intel® XScale™ technology applicability [in one source tree!]
• Clean, scalable, architecture
• Modular across companies
• Driver-based design allowing for binary linking
• C-based, no exotic tools
• Meet size and boot time requirements
• Legacy accommodation

Project Definition
• Clear distinction between public interface specs & complete firmware implementation

– EFI represents the external firmware interface spec & sample implementation
– Firmware implementation & related specs
• Two primary components

– Framework
– Key to interoperability across implementations
– Modular components
– Basic drivers (e.g. PCI, keyboard, …)
– Value added drivers/modules (e.g. Security, Silicon code, Wireless, Audio…)

Implemented Capabilities
• “Driver model architecture high reuse”

– Develop once – Si modules, drivers – use multiple times across platforms
– Extensibility offers easier SKU customization
– Modular user interface components easily replaced with OEM specific personality
– EFI System Partition provides low cost means to ship extended platform capabilities
– Binary modularity!
– Design & implementation includes ACPI engine in the core
• Would free platform from PC AT imposed legacy

– Option ROM space increased from 128k in BIOS to unlimited in EFI
– Removes VGA compatibility requirements
– Higher resolution BIOS and OS splash screens, lower cost video solutions

Goes on and on, but that is a nice list of why we should be happy Macs will not be using BIOS.

03-14-2006, 09:03 AM
a more universal solution by developing their own BIOS (BAMBIOS) which would theoretically allow the Intel Macs to support any legacy BIOS-requiring software (Linux, Windows XP, Vista etc...).

IBM researchers Singh, Smith & Reed are developing (http://www.osxbook.com/book/bonus/misc/legacyboot/) in their free time legacy BIOS support for Intel Macs. "BAMBIOS" is using Boch's BIOS emulation code and has also adapted its graphical BIOSes for the current ATi and Intel graphics chipsets used on the Intel Macs today.

The BIOS itself loads as a small EFI-capable OS that then chainloads to a second stage boot manager to then boot non-EFI OSes (editor's note: In the past some unsupported VESA 1.2 PC users used a small DOS partition to load a special DOS-based "VESA 2.0 graphics bios" code that was preparing the way for what BeOS was expecting and then it was chainloading the BeOS from DOS).

BAMBIOS is a very promising project to bring Windows and non-EFI Unices to the Mac platform, although the downside is that you most likely need updated versions for it for each new Mac released - if the Mac hardware has changed from its previous models that is. And if the trick used is indeed chainloading, then some quirky re-partitioning of the drive will be required by the user too.

To EFI, our software looks like a regular EFI program which happens to be a bootloader. This bootloader contains a binary payload which is an entire BIOS, VGA BIOS, and other x86-specific glue needed to boot the machine. This binary payload is loaded into memory in the legacy BIOS space. To all software on the machine, it appears as if the machine has a traditional BIOS. An important aspect of BAMBIOS is that its goal is to be non-disruptive." - Amit Singh

Update: Additional info from Amit Singh below. (http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=13965)


03-17-2006, 06:30 AM
Ability to boot Windows XP on and Intel-based Mac

WinXPonMac.com states:

A download link has been posted with full instructions and all the required patches to create a bootable Windows XP installation. The process requires:

An original XP PRO SP2 CDROM "It doesn't have to be bootable, but it should have a I386 directory on the root."

The xom.zip file (included in the downloadable file)
Nero Burning ROM
A blank CD


How To: Installing XP on an Intel iMac (http://wiki.onmac.net/index.php/HOWTO)
dual booting Windows XP and Mac OS X on Intel-Macs (http://daemons.net/~clay/index.php/2006/03/15/dual-booting-windows-xp-and-mac-os-x-on-intel-macs/)

04-05-2006, 08:21 AM
Apple today declared war on the Microsoft monopoly with Boot Camp Public Beta:

Available as a download beginning today, Boot Camp allows users with a Microsoft Windows XP installation disc to install Windows XP on an Intel-based Mac, and once installation is complete, users can restart their computer to run either Mac OS X or Windows XP. Boot Camp will be a feature in "Leopard," Apple's next major release of Mac OS X, that will be previewed at Apple's Worldwide Developer Conference in August.

"Apple has no desire or plan to sell or support Windows, but many customers have expressed their interest to run Windows on Apple's superior hardware now that we use Intel processors," said Philip Schiller, Apple's senior vice president of Worldwide Product Marketing. "We think Boot Camp makes the Mac even more appealing to Windows users considering making the switch."

Boot Camp simplifies Windows installation on an Intel-based Mac by providing a simple graphical step-by-step assistant application to dynamically create a second partition on the hard drive for Windows, to burn a CD with all the necessary Windows drivers, and to install Windows from a Windows XP installation CD. After installation is complete, users can choose to run either Mac OS X or Windows when they restart their computer.

The public beta of Boot Camp is available immediately as a download at www.apple.com/macosx/bootcamp, and is preview software licensed for use on a trial basis for a limited time. The final version of Boot Camp will be available as a feature in the upcoming Mac OS X version 10.5 "Leopard." Apple does not provide support for installing or running Boot Camp and does not sell or support Microsoft Windows software. Apple welcomes user feedback on Boot Camp at bootcamp@apple.com.

Bootcamp requires a firmware update for the Intel Mac running Windows:
iMac (Intel) Firmware Update 1.0
MacBook Pro (Intel) Firmware Update 1.0
Mac mini (Intel) Firmware Update 1.0

Firmware Restoration CD v 1.0
This update is used to restore the firmware of an Intel-based iMac (early 2006), Mac mini (early 2006), or MacBook Pro (early 2006) to original factory condition.

Virtualization on Leopard:

04-06-2006, 08:28 AM
One day after Apple's announcement of Boot Camp, in other word the official support for running Win XP on a MacIntel, a small IT company released the first virtualization solution for MacIntel.

It is not only a dual boot as Boot camp, it is a fully integrated virtualization solution; and it could be a preview of what will be included in Leopard and probably released in August 2006. In addition, Parallels gives you the possibility to use Linux distribs among Fedora, SUSE, Mandriva, Debian and RedHat.

To be able to do that, Parallels Workstation is taking advantage of the Intel Virtualization Technology which was only included in the last series of Intel processors (from Yonah CPU) and which are now powering the MacIntel.

Broad OS Support:
Use any version of Windows (3.1, 3.11, 95, 98, Me, 2000, NT, XP, 2003), any Linux distribution, FreeBSD, Solaris, OS/2, eComStation, or MS-DOS in secure virtual machines running alongside Mac OS X.

Great Performance:
Driven by full support for dual-core processors and Intel Virtualization Technology (included in almost every new Intel-powered Mac), virtual machines created using Parallels Workstation 2.1 Beta offer near-native performance and rock-solid stability.

Unmatched Ease of Use:
Download the program and install it with a single click. Build a virtual machine in seconds using helpful wizards. Configure virtual machines using a simple web-inspired interface.

Parallels offers VM Compactor 1.0 beta
an easy-to-use virtual hard disk management tool that optimizes performance of any Parallels, VMware or Microsoft virtual machine running Windows 2000, 2003, or XP by compacting its hard drive by up to 80 percent.

Hands-On Parallels (http://mikemchargue.com/2006/04/hands-on-with-parallels-vm-for-os-x.html)
Parallels for Mac (http://www.parallels.com/en/products/workstation/mac/)
To download the beta demo version :

04-11-2006, 08:23 AM
Vista on Intel iMac; Boot Camp Passes Muster in Speed Tests

Linked by Thom Holwerda on 2006-04-10 20:54:34 UTC, submitted by grabberslasher

Windows Vista is now running on the new Intel-based Macs. (http://grabberslasher.no-ip.com/B1FC8465-6928-4ED7-AD7C-FAA372A5DE57/21FA70D3-A47A-49A7-A6B6-5B25026D115F/6326A862-2B0F-42C8-B231-2FC40F022139.html)
"Managed to get Windows Vista installed today, with a bit of creative thinking. You see, Vista does not support Boot Camp's partitioning. There are some complex ways around this, but just to prove it can be done I booted from an XP CD, deleted the existing partitions and formatted the entire internal HD with NTFS.

Once that's done, you can reset the iMac and insert your Vista DVD before the XP setup starts installing XP."

In the meantime, CNet performed some tests, (http://news.com.com/2061-10793_3-6058832.html?tag=nl) and concluded that Apple hardware is just as good (http://news.zdnet.co.uk/software/windows/0,39020396,39262337,00.htm) at running Windows as any other x86 system.

Ars reviews Boot Camp (http://arstechnica.com/articles/columns/mac/bootcamp.ars) as well.

04-11-2006, 12:12 PM
A good article by Mike Bombich on difference between EFI and Open Firmware:

04-14-2006, 08:23 AM
Solaris on the iMac

We now have Solaris Nevada build 36 installed and running on a bootcamp equipped iMac.


04-15-2006, 11:42 AM
O'Reilly Guide to Boot Camp pdf $7.95

Want to get this Boot Camp Windows on Mac thing figured out without a lot of hassle? Theresa Pulido from O'Reilly writes "While the install of Boot Camp is relatively painless, there are pitfalls users need to avoid. Running Boot Camp (ed: a $7.99 PDF downlad) is an easy-to-follow guide that steps the user through the install and configuration process.


04-17-2006, 11:26 AM
You knew someone would have to have their linux/OS X/XP right?


Also, Resizing (GUID partition tables) volumes (http://www.macosxhints.com/article.php?story=2006041104380285)

install tip for Parallels on Intel Macs (http://www.macosxhints.com/article.php?story=20060416102528111)
Win2K, Debian Linux, and Fedora Core Linux

... and a good learning experience.

04-19-2006, 01:45 PM
Ň ...as it appears obvious to me that users of all three of the major operating system families - Windows, Mac, and Linux - are one day going to find virtualization software and support installed as a matter of course. Like a text editor or web browser, virtualization will be an expected part of an operating system."


10-08-2006, 10:25 AM
OpenSUSE 10.2 Alpha 5 Released (http://www.osnews.com/story.php/16097/OpenSUSE-10.2-Alpha-5-Released)
OpenSUSE 10.2 alpha 5 has been released (http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-announce/2006-10/msg00000.html).

Important changes: Linux kernel 2.6.18, glibc 2.5, Python 2.5, installation allows comfortable LVM partitioning, setup RAID automatically via the BIOS (so called fake-RAID support) in the partitioner, GNOME 2.16.1 (most packages are updated), KDE 3.5.5 SVN version, and more.