View Full Version : OS X on 9500/G3/500

01-21-2002, 12:58 PM
My system specs are:

Powermac 9500 with xlr8 G3/500/250, with 1Mb cache
384 Mb interleaved memory
OEM CDRom & floppy
ATI Mach64 video card in PCI B1
Orangemicro USB2/firewire card in A1
Seagate 9 Gb 80 pin SCSI drive adapted with quality high-nine terminating
adapter (yes, there is a terminator (OEM) on the end of the cable)
3 partitions: OS 9.1, 10.1.2 (the first partition), and an extra (perhaps
for Linux or Classic 9.2 someday)
xlr8 cache control software on OS 9.1, Powerlogix on 10.1.2
installed 10.1 using UUX 2.0; installed easily and without difficulty (thank
you Ryan)
KVM switch w/Mac converter to use windoze keyboard, mouse & monitor (shared
with other computers

My problems:

System always cold boots to OS 9.1; I then have to reboot using UUX to get
to X
floppy drive not recognized by OS X; however, it works fine under 9.1

Things I have tried:

Flashed PRAM, changed battery, changed motherboards, reinstalled UUX, and
changed floppy drives

Does any one have any solutions/other suggestions -- other than go buy a new computer?

01-21-2002, 02:32 PM
Not sure about the first issue. The boot drive info would be stored in the PRAM or NVRAM. If the Mac is forgetting after a cold boot then many the battery is about dead. Of course then you should be getting odd dates on your system clock - 1956 - right?

The second issues - I am fairly sure - is a limitation of X. There is no support for internal floppies in X. I think USB floppies work - I havent used a floppy on a Mac in ages.

I guess the KVM setup is working good. I suppose you are using the PS/2 to ADB converters. I tried a USB setup (Mac OS 9) and it was not the best - probably because I was going over the PCI bus (non-native USB). Funny how the PC users say they started the USB standard - yet I have not seen any USB keyboard and mice actually working in a new (1+Ghz) system. Whats up with that?

To boldly go where no english professor has gone before! -)

01-21-2002, 03:37 PM
Hey Chandler,
I gotta second d_x on the floppy thing. That's been a fairly common thread, the funniest part (as long as you have a sense of humor about losing hardware capabilities) is that Steve Jobs had a graphics behind him in the keynote that praised OSX compatability***with the floppy drive right on top of the list***. Amusing, I hope. Apple isn't doing much to support the floppy in X because they don't support the 'old world' models that came with them, except the G3 beige which it appears Apple only partially supported with OSX.

You might try a option boot and see if your computer will support that. If you hold down the option key at the chime it should bring up a icon type list of available system folders to boot from. A time saving workaround for your boot problem.

Other than that I can't think of a reason that your startup disk control panel isn't saving the OSX system selection. Corrupted maybe?

One thing that comes to mind is the possibility that your internal bus is not terminated. Shouldn't have any bearing on the startup CP but I think I heard that many of the OEM CD-Rom drives were not capable of being the terminating device. You might check that, you can always add a hard drive to get termination. Might save some trouble down the road.


01-22-2002, 04:22 AM
Well¨÷ You indicate that you've already tried replacing the battery and even (!) the motherboard. The only other possibility is the drive that OS X is installed on. It might be starting up too slowly for your OpenFirmware (OF) boot code. If the boot code times out, it falls into a standard Mac OS boot (OS 9).

Update your UUX to the new XPostFacto 2.1 (XPF) and set both your Monitor and Keyboard for OF and turn off "AutoBoot?". Don't forget to have XPF update both your XBoot and Extensions the first time you run it.

With XPF setup this way, your computer will boot into OF with the '>' prompt. To boot OS X when the drive is up to speed type "boot" and hit return. If you wish to boot into OS 9 instead, type "bye" and hit return. You will have to go through XPF to get into X again. This is because the OF 1.0.5 clears the NvRAM boot code everytime OS 9 is booted.

01-22-2002, 03:35 PM
Thanks ricks and dragon_x for the news on the floppy. Anyone recommend brands of USB floppies suitable for the purpose; my wife is a teacher who always has something on a floppy, and I am Linux/Windows native?

lasvegas, I believe you may have hit on something; last night I upgraded the Classic OS from 9.1 to 9.2 because I knew my computer couln't boot 9.2. From cold boot it attempted to boot 9.2, failed and asked if I would like to reboot; it then booted into OS X. The implications of that are that NVRAM is being written to. I will do as you say, as soon as I figure out how; I am new to Mac, although Linux native. Moreover, I must admit that action from the hard drive always seems to take quite a while from a cold start. I beleive the terminator on the end of the cable to be fine as X has never crashed in the ~40 hrs. I have used it; perhaps I should do a little drive research. I have considered an IDE card, since I have an abundance of IDE drives around, but hesitate to make the investment since I don't which ones work on unsupported machines under OS X.

01-22-2002, 04:00 PM
I had exactly the problem that you describe. I even went to the OWC booth at Macworld and talked to Ryan about it personally. He didn't have much to offer as far as a solution goes. He did acknowledge that he was aware of the problem with some Power Tower Pros, which is what I have 10.1.2 running on. He believes the problem is in the NVRAM settings for the boot disk not being saved between cold boots. He suggested buying a new PRAM battery, which I did, but that did not help either. I resolved the problem after closely rereading postings on this problem in the XLR8yourmac forums. I looked at the boot NVRAM settings in System Disc 3.3.1 and booted into X to compare them with what the running OS declares they are. Use nvram -p at the console to check what they are from within OS X. If they don't match then you can modify the settings in System Disc 3.3.1 to match the OSX settings. This did not work for me, however, as there was no difference between what System Disc and OSX reported. Here is what fixed the cold boot problem for me. I moved my OSX boot disk from the interal scsi bus to the external bus. I then tested this by booting back into OS 9.1, setting my OSX disc as the startup volume with System Disc (UUX or XPostFacto will work also), shut down, powered up again and OSX booted up as I had hoped for. I was also clued in to try this from my install experience with OSX. I realized during my initial attempts to install that if I had my CDRW (Yamaha 8424S) attached to the internal scsi bus that the drive could not read my OSX install disk. Once I moved it to the external bus the installation proceeded without incident. It took me a week of troubleshooting before I made the connection between my boot problems and my installation problems but it worked. The 9500 and the Power Tower Pro have the same logic board so I think this would work for you as well.

Here are my System Specs:

Power Tower Pro 225
Xlr8 Carrier Ziff w/OWC 10x IBM 500Mhz G3
512 MB interleaved RAM (4X128)
2x 9.1 GB 7200 RPM IBM drives-(on Initio 9100UW card)RAID 1 Stripe
1x 4.5 GB 7200 RPM IBM drive-(external bus)OS X and Classic partitions
1x 4.5 GB 7200 RPM IBM drive-(external bus)OS 9.1
Yamaha 8424S CDRW drive

slot order:
Initio Mile 9100UW SCSI card
Datatek Firewire/USB card
ATI Rage 128 Radeon card
Acard ATA 100 card
Soundblaster Live card
3DFX Voodoo 5 5500


By the way, the Voodoo 5 still works under 10.1.2 and does not cause any kernel panics during boot (the screensave does cause a kernel panic if it is running with the second monitor attached to this card, however). I use it to drive a second monitor and use it with my primary monitor when I go back to OS 9.1 to play games that haven't been carbonized. Simillarly, the Soundblaster does not cause any problems. I have my cd drive sound cable connected to the soundlaster and I still get sound through it, though my speakers have to be connected to the built-in sound out port.

[This message has been edited by marcush (edited 22 January 2002).]

[This message has been edited by marcush (edited 22 January 2002).]

01-23-2002, 01:49 AM
Chandler:¨?¨?You can fix your 9.2.1 System file by running This Patch (ftp://ftp.macgurus.com/%2fftp/osx_stuff/System_9.2.1_patch) on it.

You will need to run this patch from OS 9 or Classic, so either boot from your OS 9 CD to run the patch on your original System file or make a copy of your System file for applying the patch to and then startup Classic to run the patch.

This patch simply applies the resource from the OS 9.1 System to tell 9.2.1 that it can still run on an Oldworld Mac.