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View Full Version : PowerMac 7200 and Mac OS 8.6 (or 9.1)



Thomas
11-17-2001, 03:06 AM
I just inherited a 7200, which I am going to try to keep around and put to use.

1. Can I still get Mac OS 8.6? (I skipped from 8.5 to 9.1 on my other machine...so I do not have an 8.6 CD available. Has anyone spotted 8.6 in any bargain bins or clearance sections out there? I'd like to get a CD...)

2. Anyone running 9.1 on a 7200? (Most advice I get says stay clear of 9.1 on this machine...)

3. My plans are to get this 7200 fired up with RAM, add 8.6 (or later), add a USB card (Belkin two-port USB 1) so I can get this thing printing, and maybe even try to hook up an ethernet connection to a DSL (home) network. I don't think I'll bother with a processor upgrade, though......Any thoughts?

Thanks for any and all advice.

lasvegas
11-17-2001, 06:31 AM
Mac OS 9.1 works fine on the 7200. I have no idea why anyone would advise against it.

Any processor upgrade would be an improvement. Unfortunately, only Sonnet currently makes one that works in the 7200's L2 Cache slot. Therefore, finding one on the cheap might be a little difficult.

Thomas
11-17-2001, 04:34 PM
I've read some articles and forum posts about 9.1 dragging down older 601 and 603 machines....is the CPU really the problem, or RAM?

I figure if there is enough RAM, 9.1 should work ok....

Do you have 9.1 running in a 7200?

Tom

ChrisYip
11-18-2001, 12:05 AM
Do you mean 7300? ... regardless - I have 9.1 running on a 7300 G3/500 and a 7300 G3/400 machine - no problems...

Chris

Thomas
11-18-2001, 03:39 AM
Chris:

Sorry for the confusion.....in this case I am referring to a PowerMac 7200 (the 7300 thread you have contributed to deals with my hard drive upgrade).

I want to know if the 7200 (601 processor, right?...) is up to the task of using OS 9.1.

I haven't checked the profiler yet, but I THINK it is a 7200/120.

Tom

lasvegas
11-18-2001, 07:22 AM
Yes. I have Mac OS 9.1 running on a client's 7200/90 just fine.

TZ
11-18-2001, 04:03 PM
I tried 9.1 on 7300/200 and it was painful until I put a G3/400 and more than 128MB RAM. I also put a G3/450 into a friends and it was really nice, as nice almost as B&W. I'd think a 7200/120 (601) would be a tad better. Check out Sonnet's new price on 7200 upgrades. Better RAM support and lower prices.

Video card is going to help. One big difference I saw was in DSL ftp was being slowed down on 604e. Really slowed down. 1/3 what it was with G3 in there, so even dsl has some negotiating going on with the cpu. Not just web pages which would figure to be cpu intensive.

Gregory

sonnyjim
11-21-2001, 12:55 PM
My boss has a 7200/75 with OS 9.1 installed and 112 megs of RAM (a 64 DIMM, a 32 DIMM, and two 8 DIMMs). He brought it in for me to look at because it's way too slow. I'm going through the extensions manager now, disabling extensions that don't need to be there (e.g. speech recognition, web server...). Beyond that, not sure what to do about it. My understanding is that the CPU is not upgradeable, and he's running OS 9.1 because that's what his SCSI hard drive desired...

ChrisYip
11-21-2001, 02:12 PM
Short of filling up the RAM, your next best shot is a Sonnet 7200 G3 upgrade card... BTW 9.1 would certainly like more than the 112 MB of RAM to play with
http://www.sonnettech.com/product/crescendo_7200.html

Chris

sonnyjim
11-21-2001, 02:21 PM
Thanks! I'm letting him know his options. The board runs $250 or more, RAM can be had for much less, of course sooner or later he may just decide it's time to get a new unit...

Thomas
11-21-2001, 04:10 PM
This 7200/75 is a piece of work - but I like a challenge.

1. I added two 128MB DIMMS (now I have 272MB: 128, 128, 8, 8) and it seems to be running fine. No problem as of yet exceeding the 256MB limit...knock on wood.

2. Then, with more RAM, I was able to do a clean install of OS 9.1, and that too is running great.

3. Before I can connect my monitor to the 3D Ultimate Res 8MB video card ($40.00 bucks - what the hell: it works great in my 7300) I want to get a bigger hard drive - it only came with a 500MB drive - and there is NO ROOM LEFT on this puppy (I will probably find a simple 4GB or 9GB drive for this one...just need a little more space! Heck, I might just put the old original 2GB from my 7300 in here once I pull it...it should work, right?)

4. I don't think (as of today) I will upgrade this computer with the Sonnet 7200 G3 card. WIth a bigger hard drive and the video card hooked up,I'll then havet a fun little rig to do some email, web surfing and word processing on. I'll keep it hidden upstairs with my pet rock collection.

That's all the news fit to print for now. I'm tickled OS 9.1 is working just fine. Whew!

Tom

sonnyjim
11-21-2001, 05:53 PM
Man. I don't even believe this.

I showed my boss the upgrade board you mentioned, he takes one look at the photo, and says, "I've already got that." I was sure he was confusing it with something else, so he opens up the case and points it out to me. Sure enough, it's a Sonnet 7200 G3 upgrade card, same as in the photo.

Strange though, the computer doesn't seem to know it's there -- it still behaves like a 75mHz machine. One clue -- he didn't know about putting memory on the board. So, we took the 64 mb DIMM off the motherboard and popped it onto the Sonnet board. Result: the computer STILL doesn't know the Sonnet board is there, all it knows is it's down from 112 MB to 48MB. Groan.

So, what do we do about this? Is the board bad, or was it just not installed properly? The web page said the memory should be put on the board before installation. Should we run the Sonnet installation CD-ROM again?

Sonnyjim

P.S. My boss is happy, since at least NOW we're making progress...

ChrisYip
11-21-2001, 06:21 PM
Sounds to me like you may need to reinstall the card again - do that CUDA reset and reset the PRAM etc.. Start from scratch - might be that it didn't recognize the card the first time as the RAM wasn't on the card...

Chris

tachyon
11-21-2001, 07:55 PM
Leave the battery out of the logic board and go have lunch! That always helps more than just the CUDA reset button, for some reason.

What does Metronome say the processor speed is... if installed, it's under the Apple menu. Apple System Profiler should also report the correct speed if the card is installed & working properly.

sonnyjim
11-21-2001, 08:13 PM
Well, I'm home now, and the boss took his computer to his home as well. So now I'm in "phone support" mode...

tachyon: The system profiler, as I recall, listed the machine speed as 75mHz. As for removing the battery, I think I'd need some guidance on how to explain that to him. As I mentioned, the computer is no longer here in front of me...

chrisYip: That CUDA and reset the PRAM routine -- actually, I don't really know that as such. Was that explained in the install instructions? How do I go about talking him through that? I do agree, however, that starting from scratch does seem to be the way to go here...

Sonnyjim

Thomas
11-21-2001, 09:50 PM
Gregory:

I have installed 9.1 on both my 7300/180 (176 MB ram) and my 7200/75 (272MB ram) and it is running great on both machines (as you know, I have not done a G3/G4 upgrade on either machine).

I did install IXMicro 3D UltimateRes 8MB video cards on both - to be honest, I can't speak of great improvement on the web. It seem slike it is an issue of most web-pages being bloated and slow loaders. In my apps images refresh much faster now with the video card installed. (again, more RAM seemd to help that along as well...)

In any event, the 7200/75, even with plenty of ram and a video card is still a slow machine. Short of a Sonnet upgrade, I don;t expect this old machine to win any races. But at least it runs! If only I could get the 512k L2 external cache to work. It freezes with it installed - maybe I should try a 256k?

Tom

ChrisYip
11-22-2001, 12:33 AM
Here's some stuff from the Sonnet page:

Step 1. Run the Sonnet installer. There are no switches or jumpers to set or control panels to configure.

Step 2. Add memory to the processor card, either by moving the largest DIMMs from the motherboard, or by adding new DIMMs.* (You must leave a minimum of 16 or 32 MB of memory on the motherboard, depending on the OS version.)

Step 3. Plug the Crescendo/7200 into the first PCI slot.

Sounds to me like you need to pull the card, run the installer, and then ensure the card is in the 1st PCI slot - what slot is it in now?. Maybe that's the problem?

Chris

sonnyjim
11-23-2001, 01:40 AM
We were putting it in the PCI slot closest to the center of the machine. I'm sending him a floppy of version 1.0.2 of the install software (the Sonnet webpage emphasises that this is what works with OS 9.1), and I'll ask him to check to see if he can determine which of the three slots is labeled as the first one.

Thankfully, we figured out the procedures for resetting things, and appear to have that part down fine. First, press CUDA reset button (found it finally), then remove the battery for ten minutes (making sure to note the polarity for reinserting). We did all that, installed "properly," and it still didn't work. So, we'll try again Saturday, with new install, and making sure the first slot is what we use. If that doesn't cut it, well...

Sonnyjim

ChrisYip
11-23-2001, 09:04 AM
Use the Apple System Profiler on that machine and check what it says for the various PCI slots.. then you can see which one is #1.

I wonder if the card even appears on the list???

Chris

ChrisYip
11-23-2001, 09:07 AM
On my 7300 - PCI slot 1 is the one that is in the center of the board, closest to the power supply so it does sound like you have it in the right slot...

Chris

sonnyjim
11-23-2001, 10:37 PM
Well, I don't have the info in front of me here, but as I recall, it said that there was SOME sort of card in slot one, and since the card in slot two was the USB card, it must have been the Sonnet card. But it didn't have much to tell us about the card, except the serial number and some other obscure thing. It didn't seem to have a clue as to what the card was doing there...

On Saturday, the install upgrade will arrive at the boss's house, and we will do a talk-through on the phone. Either the new software is the key to all of this, or else we're talking a DOA board here...

Sonnyjim

Thomas
11-24-2001, 02:57 AM
PowerMac 7200 and Mac OS 8.6 (or 9.1)

sonnyjim
11-30-2001, 02:20 PM
Thanks for all your help, everyone! The card words just great now that we bought a 128MB DIMM and put it on the Crescendo card. So, there's 128MB on the card, 112 MB on the motherboard, and Virtual Memory is on to the tune of another 256MB.

Now, I'm having to do a bit of TCP/IP repair, but I want to try The Most Obvious Solutions first before posting my system error plight here. Hmmm, wonder what forum I should post THAT in...

Thanks again,

Sonnyjim